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Post by rj2para (Bisto) on May 9, 2009 21:18:56 GMT 1
Having just been out twice today on the bike I bought a copy of Fast Bike having ridden home evening trying hanging my leg off Rossi style.  Almost died laughing, must have looked a right twonk  But it was on a country lane so what the heck. Anyway back to Fast bike the DVD had a video on track riding which was interesting and led me to Googling Keith Code which I recommend. I also found www.vf750fd.com/blurbs/countercode.htmlWhich then led me to |
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Post by McF on May 10, 2009 8:48:28 GMT 1
It works but how? I've had it explained to me many times, but it sounds sooo wrong. the links from RJ to two explanations make a lot more sense. I found this www.youtube.com/watch?v=B8IdTq3_3WI with an interesting demonstration from 2'30" Pick a quiet road and try it sometime! At an extreme, think of speedway riders, now that is counter steering, but don't try that on your bike! |
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Post by De Graaf van Salland on May 10, 2009 9:55:48 GMT 1
I actually thought that everybody understood counter steering; it's quite simple: If you want to turn to the right: push with your right hand. This will rotate the handlebar a bit to the left. The result is that your contact point with the road will move to the left. The centre of gravity is now no longer above the contactpoint, but a bit to the right of it. If you do nothing, you will fall over. The only way to stop falling over is to start turning to the right, because this will create a centrifugal force pushing the centre of gravity outwards, which prevents you from falling over. After the bend there are 2 ways of getting the bike upright again: 1. Position the contact point with the road under the centre of gravity again, by rotating the handle bar in the appropriate direction. 2. Increase speed, because this will increase the centrifugal force, which will automatically make the bike come upright. One of the exercises during the excellent KNMV courses is collision-avoidance. During this exercise they make you push your handlebar away rather hard with one hand (push with left, makes the bike move to the left). In order to speed up this motion, they also teach you to 'hinge' your body at the hips: the upper part of your body must stay upright, while the bike below you is at an angle. If the bike doesn't have to rotate the whole body of the rider as well, this avoidance-operation goes a bit faster. Franklin www.knmv.nl/opleidingen/cursusaanbod |
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Post by rj2para (Bisto) on May 10, 2009 21:03:51 GMT 1
Interesting. That course sounded fun Franklin.
Yes I was aware of it and am still trying to use it more often. The point about it starting to work over approx 10mph was interesting and I had not thought of using it on my push bike, ;D that could be fun.
I modified your post Mcf to add the YouTube option in the post. Hope you don't mind.
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Post by McF on Jul 10, 2009 11:07:43 GMT 1
As mentioned in other posts, most especially the thread on "weight balance" www.ntvhonda.proboards.com/index.cgi?action=display&board=test2&thread=574&page=1I've been focussing on counter steering a lot more during recent rides. It's still feels completely "wrong", but I'm using the bars a lot more to initiate and recover from turns, rather than using body weight etc. I began one day riding on a very quiet dual carriageway. Picked a line in the centre of the road. Cruise control on and removed hands an inch or so from the bars. Applied a light pressure to the left bar without doing anything else and the bike started to lean to the left, and of course started to steer towards the left. Removed the pressure and the bike came upright and steered straight ahead. Same for the right. As I had the whole road to myself, I then started changing lanes using the above technique and using the whole width of the road, just applying a little pressure on the bars. That move on to slalom (by this time I was holding the bars  ) and weaving between the gaps in the central white lines. It provides a very responsive and precise way to control the bike. It's still a very conscious thing while I'm cornering, but I am trying to use the bars a lot more as the control input, rather than use body weight and "trim" with the bars. Interested to hear other views on this. |
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Post by De Graaf van Salland on Jul 10, 2009 21:42:46 GMT 1
Have a look at this video:
This guy could never do this without the counter steering.
He also demonstrates the "hinging at the waist". By hinging at the waist he can lean the bike over a bit more and thus decrease his turning radius.
Brilliant riding I would say. I wish that I could do this.
However, I would wear a decent jacket........... (Oh those elbows, if he should fall).
Ride safe !
Franklin
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Post by rj2para (Bisto) on Jul 10, 2009 22:39:26 GMT 1
Respect! That said I am also working on this and have found I can turn in much more smoothly. Looking through the bend also helps, particularly when you get an, oh sh1t moment. Hanging out your knee actually works as a wind brake pulling you over encouraging lean. I assume Rossi's leg out style must be even better. But currently I lack the commitment. I think it needs to be practiced in case of an emergency, ie a cager trys to take you out. I feel I may need to work on my wooden seat and get a matched pair of tyres prior to trying thid out on my Revere! ;D  |
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Almost died laughing, must have looked a right twonk 
But it was on a country lane so what the heck.
) and weaving between the gaps in the central white lines. It provides a very responsive and precise way to control the bike.