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Post by De Graaf van Salland on Mar 21, 2009 8:54:16 GMT 1
Last week I got stranded in the middle of nowhere (yes, that is possible in Holland), some 20 miles from home. I made a road-side alteration (seen below) which made it possible that I could ride home.  As long as there is enough fuel in the tank, the bike will run with out the pump: gravity will feed the carbs. I had done already some 200 km's on this tank (usual refill after 300 km's). Fortunately the amount of fuel in the tank was sufficient. Close the fuel tap, then find an old rag to catch the petrol spillage. I carry one with me to check the oil level. Remove the tube from the outlet side of the filter. Also remove the tube, which goes from the pump to the carbs. You can now rotate this tube 180° and it will fit onto the open side of the filter. Tie the old rag around the open tubes of the pump, to prevent too much petrol spillage & dirt entering the pump. Then don't forget to open the fuel tap again. (which I did....) and re-start the bike. Once you get home: close the tap again. Otherwise your carb-chambers might overflow. I've been looking around for a new / replacement pump, but they're either not available or very expensive. So I think that I'll be riding without a pump for some time........... Ride safely (with or without fuel pump) Franklin |
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Post by McF on Mar 21, 2009 9:16:25 GMT 1
Last week I got stranded in the middle of nowhere (yes, that is possible in Holland), some 20 miles from home. Well at least you didn't have to think about pushing your bike up steep hills if it had come to that! As always Franklin, thanks for an excellent "how to" post. Let's hope no-one else needs this roadside innovation. But more importantly, I hope you source a proper solution quickly and at an acceptable price. As with the rear shock theme, it is worth considering a pump from other bikes. I'd start from the logic that the pump from any medium to large size Honda would be identical. I would not be surprised if pumps from most Japanese bikes weren't interchangeable. |
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Post by rj2para (Bisto) on Mar 21, 2009 12:30:10 GMT 1
I have also tried the same dodge and it does work well with a full pump, but it is said to have problems with motorway work. (not tried this so I can not confirm)
I have since replaced my pump with one froma crb 600 of the same vintage. Mine has a breather tube (don't know what it does) but it has worked fine since.
May be worth as mcf says looking at crb's as well, what about a hawk pump.
Good luck.
Happy to help you search.
Roger
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Post by De Graaf van Salland on Mar 21, 2009 16:28:00 GMT 1
I've just come back from the "Brezan" (which is a dutch chain of automotive shops), with a brand new universal fuel pump.
I searched the internet for a second-hand one & actually found one about an hours drive away.
They asked € 75 for it, but then it's still second hand & you don't know how long it will last.
So I thought I'll pay a visit to the local Brezan-shop & see if they can supply something.
Well they came up with a universal pump, which is only slightly larger than the original one. And it cost me about € 85 (brand new).
I entered the make & type etc. in google and found that some guy had used this exact pump as a replacement on his Varadero and had done already some 50.000 km with it. So not a bad pump.
The pump will fit into the cradle, but you have to make modifications to the tubes, because the diameters are different.
But here's my new problem: when I tried to find out what the + and the - connections were, I found out that the electrical supply to the pump is only about 1 volt.
So the pump wasn't faulty at all, but the electrics were !
I had a quick look at the fuses; they seemed to be OK.
Any other suggestions ?
Franklin
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Post by rj2para (Bisto) on Mar 21, 2009 20:02:54 GMT 1
This is starting to sound like the problem I had last year in which a major clean of all connection plugs helped but the final solution involved replacing a section of my loom as the internal cables had started to corode. If nobody else can suggest the location of said suspect loom I will call my mechanic. i seem to remember sickpup posting it was a common issue some months back so it may be worth a quick scan through his posts on this forum. currently cooking dinner so I can't right now  r. |
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Post by Buzzin (^_^) on Mar 21, 2009 21:31:19 GMT 1
That 1 volt, was that with the engine running?
As you might know the pump on an NTV only works when the ignition works (how exactly is unknown to me)
Perhaps that little circuit is broken?
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Post by De Graaf van Salland on Mar 21, 2009 21:58:17 GMT 1
The 0,5 to 1 volt (I could barely see the needle of my voltmeter moving) was with the engine running. I know the pump isn't powered when there is no ignition.
I don't suspect a corrosion problem.
I have a feeling that a fuse has blown somwhere (that could account for a extremely small voltage still there).
Or de relay for the pump has given up; but I do not think that I would find any voltage at all, in that case.
If there was corrosion in the wires or a bad contact, I would suspect a gradual increase of problems.
But this problem (see top post) occured suddenly.
That's also why I suspected a pump failure and never bothered to check the electrical supply.
Apart from the small fuse box, located close to your right knee, is there any other place where I could find fuses on this bike ?
Franklin
PS Roger, What did you cook for dinner ?
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Post by McF on Mar 22, 2009 8:26:15 GMT 1
Apart from the small fuse box, located close to your right knee, is there any other place where I could find fuses on this bike ? On J,K and M models (two piece handlebars) the fuses are under a panel on the top yoke. If yours is the later (model P onwards) the fuses box is under the right hand side panel as described. The main fuse is part of the starter relay which can be found under the left side panel, but if that blows, your bike will not start. The Haynes Manual, Chapter 9 Section 27 talks you through the checks for fuel pump and its electrical supply, you can find an electronic version here wbieniec.kis.p.lodz.pl/moto/ntv/manual/9.pdf. Good luck and keep us posted. |
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Post by De Graaf van Salland on Mar 22, 2009 20:25:47 GMT 1
Thanks for all the tips. I promised my wife to wallpaper our hallway today. And, you know, some things just take priority........  So the bike will just have to wait. I'll keep you lot informed. Franklin |
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Post by Jaz66 on Mar 23, 2009 1:30:53 GMT 1
Hi Franklin. Nice to see the inventiveness of your work around actually got you home again.. (as McF says, Nice description so others in similar spots can do the same...  ) Hope the soultion is easy to find...  Have added this post re universal fuel pump to Other bike parts for the NTV Could have been a good guide for rj's rear spring, if i had of remembered... If you would be so kind to tell us the make and model Number, perhaps we could add that as well to help uk bikers to identify pump to bike store over here. or you could become the Netherlands UK distributor for the fuel Pump.. (Got to be a big market..NTV, Revere, africa twin ....etc;.. ;D ) |
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Post by De Graaf van Salland on Mar 23, 2009 21:36:17 GMT 1
I really don't want to make you happy with something that's not going to work. So I'd like to keep the technical data to myself untill I know that it all fits & works. Just a little more patience........ In the meantime: have a look at this link: www.africatwin.ru/africafiles/manual/fuelpump.pdfThe NTV / Revere / Transalp / Africa Twin & Varadero all suffer from a bad fuel pump. The problem is the spark between the contact points every time the contact is broken. This spark will eventually evaporate the metal of the points. The problem here is the amount of amps going through the points at the moment the contact is broken. Less amps means a smaller spark. You can get lesser amps by riding with a full tank all the time. But some guy in Sweden had an idea move the power switch from inside the pump to the outside of the pump (see the link above). The contact points inside the pump are then only used to switch a relais, which in turn powers the fuel pump. Clever idea ! This modification is only usefull if your contact points are still OK; then it will make them last a lot longer. Franklin |
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