Post by Jaz66 on Jan 25, 2009 13:35:37 GMT 1
McF
An interesting day!
Had to come to central London late last night for an early meeting today.
Listening to breakfast news and heard that Bikers can use Bus/Taxi lanes from Jan 09
Left my helmet, panniers etc with the porters at the club I stayed at. One "bright" young man stuck the luggage ticket ON MY VISOR!, right in front of where my right eye is
A nice day so I decided to walk to my meeting circa 2 miles. Enjoyed the scenery as young ladies made their way to work and then spotted first one and then a second NTV. Both Black and looked in use as courier bikes.
After my meeting I walked back to the club, got changed into biker gear delighted to see sticker had been very carefully removed by a sympathic biker head porter.
Took my gear out to the bike and packed it away then spotted the parking ticket
I was now stood at the front of the bike looking back to the kerb and saw the huge sign "phone / text this number and pay £1.50 per day to park here"
So - £40 (if I pay straight away) to learn that you cannot assume parking your bike anywhere is free. I've never paid to park and this was in a roadside "Motorbikes only" space with a couple of other bikes already there.
I have only myself to blame and am kicking myself at the needless waste of so many beer coupons. However - who would take a chance of getting hit for £40 if it only costs £1.50 to park? - Certainly not me and when I can claim back parking fees but not parking fines
Westminster City Council - thanks very much!
Fellow NTVers - beware whenever you park
Drove out of London in normal for London traffic and felt fully acquantained with everything I like about driving in the City - Nothing!
Said "hi" to Jaz and NTV Nick as I passed Hammersmith and Twickers respectively
***********************************
jaz66
Ah M8
Thats a B1tch...
Trouble is most boroughs will copy Westminster if it's successful,
in London and probably all around the country.
(Its easy money ..Charge them for parking where and how they do now and then you can also fine them if the don't pay to park =Win / Win for the councils....
Hard for us city dwellers to get used to to, F*** knows how strangers to town are meant to keep up with individual boroughs parking regimes.
My borough lets me park almost ANYWHERE for Free.
Residents bays/ pay and display, etc...
Yet i still see bike bays in the borough full of bike on top of bike because its NOT clear where else bikers can park.
Not the right place to rant about a local issue.... , but if anyone is interested in the London debate or wants a heads up on whats coming their way
(Most large Metropolitan areas will have similar problems and be looking to this as a solution... , Guaranteed )
These links have a lively debate about the pro's and con's
www.bikechatforums.com/viewtopic.php?t=151932
www.bikechatforums.com/viewtopic.php?t=151932
Not sure these links cover it but has been suggested that as this is an "Experimental Scheme" Fines can not be enforced..
Not sure where i saw it but will have a hunt around for it.
Maybe appealing before you pay might be a good idea?
anyway on a more positive note
Quote:Enjoyed the scenery as young ladies made their way to work
Know what you mean,
Quote:Drove out of London in normal for London traffic and felt fully acquantained with everything I like about driving in the City - Nothing!
Yeah, that ticket does leave a nasty taste, but there are some perks once you get used to it.
Like cruising past lines of stationary traffic, knowing your journey will take you a quarter of the time it takes the average car driver.........Priceless
Quote:Said "hi" to Jaz and NTV Nick as I passed Hammersmith and Twickers respectively
Cheers for the thought..
Best regards
Jaz
***********************************
jaz66
Hi M8
Did say i would try and get back re parking ticket
Try this link for a start
forum.notobikeparkingfees.com/dis....offence/#Item_0
Might save you some money IF you haven't already paid..
This was the parent folder
forum.notobikeparkingfees.com/
Lots of angry Bikers but a few sensible points as well
And for anyone traveling into the big city, here is a borough by borough guide to parking a motorbike
"Big it up" For Fulham and Hammersmiths enlightened view of bike parking...... (where I park)....
www.motorcycleparking.com/parking_london.shtml
For first time visitors to London this might be useful.
Probably applies to a few big cities
www.kevinboone.com/PF_mc-faq.html
And as an added side note, for those in town who DO park wherever they can. Enjoy it while you can because it is coming to an end...
I reckon most councils will probably adopt this scheme if successful, to squeeze money out of us
www.motorcycleparking.com/
Best regards
Jaz
***********************************
jaz66
One for you McF
"I was parking my car up yesterday,when a rather angry traffic warden banged on the window and shouted," You can't park your car there mate".
I said," I f**king can,the sign says
......' Fine for Parking '.
Ride safe
jaz
***********************************
ntvnick
Oh dear, good old Westminster Council, may they rot in hell. I was in town for London Open House last month and was on the bike. I was parked up in a marked bike bay with 4 other bikes just off the Strand and when I returned all 5 bikes had a ticket, this was Saturday afternoon and the road was deserted. Closer inspection revealed a notice closing the bike bay due to 'water works'. No works were in progress or indeed any sign of them starting. I appealed as I pointed out there was plenty of available parking for a bike on a Saturday afternoon and I was not disrupting any works. But lost the appeal as ignorance is no defense etc and they wanted my money. £60 thank you very much
Oh thanks for the thought MCF but I live in Ickenham not Twickenham. Mind I work in Shepherds Bush, so you were very close in Hammersmith.
***********************************
jaz66
Hi
Nick writes
Quote:Mind I work in Shepherds Bush, so you were very close in Hammersmith.
That makes us almost neighbours.....
BTW, Bet driving around the Bush is gonna be a Bit5h for the next few days now Westfields is open............
Ride safe
jaz
***********************************
McF
I submitted an appeal online, based on previously parked there (not in 2008 though) and not normally used to paying to park my bike. Never thought to look for a sign, had left my helmet on and carried my panniers away from the (now obvious) sign.
I work with several people who live "in town" who believe I wasted my time - that may be the case, but nothing ventured....
I'll let you know how I get on - fingers, toes and eyes crossed!
A bonus for me when I logged into the website is that I could view the whole case for the prosecution - inlcuding 4 photos of my bike - thanks Westminster!
Rode back up to Leatherhead (from Gosport) this morning for meetings - glad of my extra layers and a big fairing today!
1550 and there is still snow on the ground ***********************************
McF
I was quick to criticise, I'd like to be just as quick to tell you - GOOD NEWS
The General phoned me today as a letter had arrived from Westminster City Council - my appeal has been upheld; they don't even require me to pay the £1.50 parking fee. There is a rebuke, which I accept, instructing me that it is the driver's responsibility to check what conditions apply when parking any vehicle, even one you don't normally pay to park.
We can debate the pros and cons of how fair it is to be charged for parking a bike (I think it's ridiculous), but I am heartened that my apologies and explanation were accepted.
Note to self - check, check, check for notices, pitfalls, wardens, minefields and other miserable boogers.
PS - back in "town" again next Tues - Holborn this time but I hope there is on site parking at this location.
***********************************
jaz66
He shoots, He Scores, RESULT
Nothing to lose appealing against the Machine
Now the general has an extra few bob in her pocket ( Your potential fine )
To spend on her good self at the shops.. ...........
Gonna be in holborn, would this help
maps.thepieguide.com/pfb-ext/
Enter Holborn then ec1.wc2 etc
gives a list of bays in that area.
Top tip for parking in London:
get there BEFORE 8.15am.
Got in late one morning had to go back home and return on tube,
NO BL00dy spaces left
Just remembered, IF you cant find a space at Holborn, drive on, go past Liverpool st station, almost the next st is the borough of Hackney, it has bikes AND free parking in residents bays.
Bike bays full cos few realise residents bays are also free
I always found LOADS of spaces when I was up town. (Bit of a slep on the tube back to holborn, but better than a ticket or going back home... )
Here's a link to where I parked
www.streetmap.co.uk/newmap.srf?x=....&ay=182015&lm=0
Check it out with Google earth maps.
Good Luck
As an aside, for anyone going to Westfields Shopping Mall at shepherds bush.
Website does not state it but Bike parking IS Free.
No dedicated bike bays yet, was pointed out that bikes can park in empty car bays, (also told that parking on paved area just inside Carpark, by disabled bays was OK as well, * but check before parking)
We parked up outside 'Valet Parking' just by concierge.
Literally Moments from centre of Mall, much to other half's delight
She went from Biker chick to dedicated fashion victim is moments
On exit press telephone icon at barrier, inform office that your are a Bike/Scooter and moments later they will let you out.
regards
jaz
***********************************
McF
Thanks for all that useful info Jazz
I'm not sure if there is parking at the building I'm heading for in Holborn; I have plenty of backup sites if there isn't.
The General is happy to ride pillion, but her shopping trips require a large van for the return journey. Despite the enormous volume of luggage space on the Pan it just isn't enough! That's why I'm normally excused going to the shops
***********************************
sickpup
Some additional parking tips.
If you have a company name or advertising on the side of your bike most Boroughs allow you 20 minutes parking on single yellow lines and 10 minutes on doubles.
Westminster has the most lax rules for business use bikes, you even park for free on meters when loading unloading.
The middle of the road is a great place to park. As long as there are no zigzags parking in the middle of the road inline with traffic islands is considered acceptable as long as you don't obstruct the flow of traffic. There is a chance you may get nicked for obstructing a road sign if there is one but this would be enforced by the MET police and they have better things to do. I've left marked bikes parked in the middle of the road for hours without problems.
***********************************
jaz66
Quote:The middle of the road is a great place to park. As long as there are no zigzags parking in the middle of the road inline with traffic islands is considered acceptable as long as you don't obstruct the flow of traffic. There is a chance you may get nicked for obstructing a road sign if there is one but this would be enforced by the MET police and they have better things to do. I've left marked bikes parked in the middle of the road for hours without problems.
I wondered about that!
seen quite a few parked up in front of traffic islands, etc
Always thought that was an automatic ticket
Quote:If you have a company name or advertising on the side of your bike most Boroughs allow you 20 minutes parking on single yellow lines and 10 minutes on doubles.
Have seen 'magnetic' signs for vehicles.
Might be worthwhile getting some ads done up and simply slapping them on bike when required..
***********************************
hubcap
I've got a good tip for you, don't park in Blackpool. Ticketed after two hours, and if there's two bikes in one parking space.. you get two tickets. Aren't they lovely.
***********************************
McF
Not as lovely as the nice people in Westminster who are my new best friends
A Yorkshire will say almost anything for £40!
Definition of a Yorkshireman? A Scotsman with all the genorosity kicked out of him!
***********************************
ntvnick
Good luck to you MCF, nice to see someone get a result, as you can see, I'm back on nights, which does give me a bit of a chance to peruse the forum during the quieter bits.
@ Jazz66 - I have to say Westfield is a treat for me having worked here for 20 years with b*gger all about, we thought we were spoilt when the Tesco metro opened up in the Media Village a couple of years ago. Most of the shops in Westfield arn't for me, but I can get decent sarnies from Waitrose and there is a socking great Marks and WH Smiths. An early glitch, this evening one of the large illuminated letters was out and it read We tfields.
Nothing to do with parking or bikes, but I have another Honda. My wife has been wanting a Hybrid for a while and I bought a Civic Hybrid. In 1500 miles it has averaged 57 to the gallon, which is bloody good for a petrol engine. Ours is the previous model with a manual box. On a run up to Norfolk it manages 62MPG, but town use drags it back down. The electric motor is only for assistance, it will not pull away on it like a Prius.
***********************************
jaz66
Hi ntvnick
Yeah, if your up by the A40 end, bugger all around.
Like you say Westfields has a wide choice of shops, but not all of use to me either.
Smiths, M&S, Waitrose and Foyles are my Favs so far.
Apple store is pretty spectacular.
Food courts look excellent.
Missus recommends The Duck burger...
Quote:An early glitch, this evening one of the large illuminated letters was out and it read We tfields.
Lights are a Pet hate of mine, it just makes anywhere seem less polished when lights are left out for days.
And should there really be lights out already...?
it only opened a few weeks ago...
Nice MPG on the car BTW M8...
Regards
Jaz
***********************************
McF
Is this We tField a local shop for local people?
Duck Burger - mmm sounds good
Fuel on your Honda sounds good. looks like Diesel engines (my Passat = 50+mpg) are becoming less attractive when the d**n fuel costs so much more than petrol these days
***********************************
An interesting day!
Had to come to central London late last night for an early meeting today.
Listening to breakfast news and heard that Bikers can use Bus/Taxi lanes from Jan 09
Left my helmet, panniers etc with the porters at the club I stayed at. One "bright" young man stuck the luggage ticket ON MY VISOR!, right in front of where my right eye is
A nice day so I decided to walk to my meeting circa 2 miles. Enjoyed the scenery as young ladies made their way to work and then spotted first one and then a second NTV. Both Black and looked in use as courier bikes.
After my meeting I walked back to the club, got changed into biker gear delighted to see sticker had been very carefully removed by a sympathic biker head porter.
Took my gear out to the bike and packed it away then spotted the parking ticket
I was now stood at the front of the bike looking back to the kerb and saw the huge sign "phone / text this number and pay £1.50 per day to park here"
So - £40 (if I pay straight away) to learn that you cannot assume parking your bike anywhere is free. I've never paid to park and this was in a roadside "Motorbikes only" space with a couple of other bikes already there.
I have only myself to blame and am kicking myself at the needless waste of so many beer coupons. However - who would take a chance of getting hit for £40 if it only costs £1.50 to park? - Certainly not me and when I can claim back parking fees but not parking fines
Westminster City Council - thanks very much!
Fellow NTVers - beware whenever you park
Drove out of London in normal for London traffic and felt fully acquantained with everything I like about driving in the City - Nothing!
Said "hi" to Jaz and NTV Nick as I passed Hammersmith and Twickers respectively
***********************************
jaz66
Ah M8
Thats a B1tch...
Trouble is most boroughs will copy Westminster if it's successful,
in London and probably all around the country.
(Its easy money ..Charge them for parking where and how they do now and then you can also fine them if the don't pay to park =Win / Win for the councils....
Hard for us city dwellers to get used to to, F*** knows how strangers to town are meant to keep up with individual boroughs parking regimes.
My borough lets me park almost ANYWHERE for Free.
Residents bays/ pay and display, etc...
Yet i still see bike bays in the borough full of bike on top of bike because its NOT clear where else bikers can park.
Not the right place to rant about a local issue.... , but if anyone is interested in the London debate or wants a heads up on whats coming their way
(Most large Metropolitan areas will have similar problems and be looking to this as a solution... , Guaranteed )
These links have a lively debate about the pro's and con's
www.bikechatforums.com/viewtopic.php?t=151932
www.bikechatforums.com/viewtopic.php?t=151932
Not sure these links cover it but has been suggested that as this is an "Experimental Scheme" Fines can not be enforced..
Not sure where i saw it but will have a hunt around for it.
Maybe appealing before you pay might be a good idea?
anyway on a more positive note
Quote:Enjoyed the scenery as young ladies made their way to work
Know what you mean,
Quote:Drove out of London in normal for London traffic and felt fully acquantained with everything I like about driving in the City - Nothing!
Yeah, that ticket does leave a nasty taste, but there are some perks once you get used to it.
Like cruising past lines of stationary traffic, knowing your journey will take you a quarter of the time it takes the average car driver.........Priceless
Quote:Said "hi" to Jaz and NTV Nick as I passed Hammersmith and Twickers respectively
Cheers for the thought..
Best regards
Jaz
***********************************
jaz66
Hi M8
Did say i would try and get back re parking ticket
Try this link for a start
forum.notobikeparkingfees.com/dis....offence/#Item_0
Might save you some money IF you haven't already paid..
This was the parent folder
forum.notobikeparkingfees.com/
Lots of angry Bikers but a few sensible points as well
And for anyone traveling into the big city, here is a borough by borough guide to parking a motorbike
"Big it up" For Fulham and Hammersmiths enlightened view of bike parking...... (where I park)....
www.motorcycleparking.com/parking_london.shtml
For first time visitors to London this might be useful.
Probably applies to a few big cities
www.kevinboone.com/PF_mc-faq.html
And as an added side note, for those in town who DO park wherever they can. Enjoy it while you can because it is coming to an end...
I reckon most councils will probably adopt this scheme if successful, to squeeze money out of us
www.motorcycleparking.com/
Best regards
Jaz
***********************************
jaz66
One for you McF
"I was parking my car up yesterday,when a rather angry traffic warden banged on the window and shouted," You can't park your car there mate".
I said," I f**king can,the sign says
......' Fine for Parking '.
Ride safe
jaz
***********************************
ntvnick
Oh dear, good old Westminster Council, may they rot in hell. I was in town for London Open House last month and was on the bike. I was parked up in a marked bike bay with 4 other bikes just off the Strand and when I returned all 5 bikes had a ticket, this was Saturday afternoon and the road was deserted. Closer inspection revealed a notice closing the bike bay due to 'water works'. No works were in progress or indeed any sign of them starting. I appealed as I pointed out there was plenty of available parking for a bike on a Saturday afternoon and I was not disrupting any works. But lost the appeal as ignorance is no defense etc and they wanted my money. £60 thank you very much
Oh thanks for the thought MCF but I live in Ickenham not Twickenham. Mind I work in Shepherds Bush, so you were very close in Hammersmith.
***********************************
jaz66
Hi
Nick writes
Quote:Mind I work in Shepherds Bush, so you were very close in Hammersmith.
That makes us almost neighbours.....
BTW, Bet driving around the Bush is gonna be a Bit5h for the next few days now Westfields is open............
Ride safe
jaz
***********************************
McF
I submitted an appeal online, based on previously parked there (not in 2008 though) and not normally used to paying to park my bike. Never thought to look for a sign, had left my helmet on and carried my panniers away from the (now obvious) sign.
I work with several people who live "in town" who believe I wasted my time - that may be the case, but nothing ventured....
I'll let you know how I get on - fingers, toes and eyes crossed!
A bonus for me when I logged into the website is that I could view the whole case for the prosecution - inlcuding 4 photos of my bike - thanks Westminster!
Rode back up to Leatherhead (from Gosport) this morning for meetings - glad of my extra layers and a big fairing today!
1550 and there is still snow on the ground ***********************************
McF
I was quick to criticise, I'd like to be just as quick to tell you - GOOD NEWS
The General phoned me today as a letter had arrived from Westminster City Council - my appeal has been upheld; they don't even require me to pay the £1.50 parking fee. There is a rebuke, which I accept, instructing me that it is the driver's responsibility to check what conditions apply when parking any vehicle, even one you don't normally pay to park.
We can debate the pros and cons of how fair it is to be charged for parking a bike (I think it's ridiculous), but I am heartened that my apologies and explanation were accepted.
Note to self - check, check, check for notices, pitfalls, wardens, minefields and other miserable boogers.
PS - back in "town" again next Tues - Holborn this time but I hope there is on site parking at this location.
***********************************
jaz66
He shoots, He Scores, RESULT
Nothing to lose appealing against the Machine
Now the general has an extra few bob in her pocket ( Your potential fine )
To spend on her good self at the shops.. ...........
Gonna be in holborn, would this help
maps.thepieguide.com/pfb-ext/
Enter Holborn then ec1.wc2 etc
gives a list of bays in that area.
Top tip for parking in London:
get there BEFORE 8.15am.
Got in late one morning had to go back home and return on tube,
NO BL00dy spaces left
Just remembered, IF you cant find a space at Holborn, drive on, go past Liverpool st station, almost the next st is the borough of Hackney, it has bikes AND free parking in residents bays.
Bike bays full cos few realise residents bays are also free
I always found LOADS of spaces when I was up town. (Bit of a slep on the tube back to holborn, but better than a ticket or going back home... )
Here's a link to where I parked
www.streetmap.co.uk/newmap.srf?x=....&ay=182015&lm=0
Check it out with Google earth maps.
Good Luck
As an aside, for anyone going to Westfields Shopping Mall at shepherds bush.
Website does not state it but Bike parking IS Free.
No dedicated bike bays yet, was pointed out that bikes can park in empty car bays, (also told that parking on paved area just inside Carpark, by disabled bays was OK as well, * but check before parking)
We parked up outside 'Valet Parking' just by concierge.
Literally Moments from centre of Mall, much to other half's delight
She went from Biker chick to dedicated fashion victim is moments
On exit press telephone icon at barrier, inform office that your are a Bike/Scooter and moments later they will let you out.
regards
jaz
***********************************
McF
Thanks for all that useful info Jazz
I'm not sure if there is parking at the building I'm heading for in Holborn; I have plenty of backup sites if there isn't.
The General is happy to ride pillion, but her shopping trips require a large van for the return journey. Despite the enormous volume of luggage space on the Pan it just isn't enough! That's why I'm normally excused going to the shops
***********************************
sickpup
Some additional parking tips.
If you have a company name or advertising on the side of your bike most Boroughs allow you 20 minutes parking on single yellow lines and 10 minutes on doubles.
Westminster has the most lax rules for business use bikes, you even park for free on meters when loading unloading.
The middle of the road is a great place to park. As long as there are no zigzags parking in the middle of the road inline with traffic islands is considered acceptable as long as you don't obstruct the flow of traffic. There is a chance you may get nicked for obstructing a road sign if there is one but this would be enforced by the MET police and they have better things to do. I've left marked bikes parked in the middle of the road for hours without problems.
***********************************
jaz66
Quote:The middle of the road is a great place to park. As long as there are no zigzags parking in the middle of the road inline with traffic islands is considered acceptable as long as you don't obstruct the flow of traffic. There is a chance you may get nicked for obstructing a road sign if there is one but this would be enforced by the MET police and they have better things to do. I've left marked bikes parked in the middle of the road for hours without problems.
I wondered about that!
seen quite a few parked up in front of traffic islands, etc
Always thought that was an automatic ticket
Quote:If you have a company name or advertising on the side of your bike most Boroughs allow you 20 minutes parking on single yellow lines and 10 minutes on doubles.
Have seen 'magnetic' signs for vehicles.
Might be worthwhile getting some ads done up and simply slapping them on bike when required..
***********************************
hubcap
I've got a good tip for you, don't park in Blackpool. Ticketed after two hours, and if there's two bikes in one parking space.. you get two tickets. Aren't they lovely.
***********************************
McF
Not as lovely as the nice people in Westminster who are my new best friends
A Yorkshire will say almost anything for £40!
Definition of a Yorkshireman? A Scotsman with all the genorosity kicked out of him!
***********************************
ntvnick
Good luck to you MCF, nice to see someone get a result, as you can see, I'm back on nights, which does give me a bit of a chance to peruse the forum during the quieter bits.
@ Jazz66 - I have to say Westfield is a treat for me having worked here for 20 years with b*gger all about, we thought we were spoilt when the Tesco metro opened up in the Media Village a couple of years ago. Most of the shops in Westfield arn't for me, but I can get decent sarnies from Waitrose and there is a socking great Marks and WH Smiths. An early glitch, this evening one of the large illuminated letters was out and it read We tfields.
Nothing to do with parking or bikes, but I have another Honda. My wife has been wanting a Hybrid for a while and I bought a Civic Hybrid. In 1500 miles it has averaged 57 to the gallon, which is bloody good for a petrol engine. Ours is the previous model with a manual box. On a run up to Norfolk it manages 62MPG, but town use drags it back down. The electric motor is only for assistance, it will not pull away on it like a Prius.
***********************************
jaz66
Hi ntvnick
Yeah, if your up by the A40 end, bugger all around.
Like you say Westfields has a wide choice of shops, but not all of use to me either.
Smiths, M&S, Waitrose and Foyles are my Favs so far.
Apple store is pretty spectacular.
Food courts look excellent.
Missus recommends The Duck burger...
Quote:An early glitch, this evening one of the large illuminated letters was out and it read We tfields.
Lights are a Pet hate of mine, it just makes anywhere seem less polished when lights are left out for days.
And should there really be lights out already...?
it only opened a few weeks ago...
Nice MPG on the car BTW M8...
Regards
Jaz
***********************************
McF
Is this We tField a local shop for local people?
Duck Burger - mmm sounds good
Fuel on your Honda sounds good. looks like Diesel engines (my Passat = 50+mpg) are becoming less attractive when the d**n fuel costs so much more than petrol these days
***********************************
